2007-04-27 [Byne]: Thank you so much!

2007-04-28 [Ramirez]: I think that what we (or you guys) should do is do some research on some orginizations that need donations or volunteer work, and maybe write a bit about these orginizations and give links to them. It's nice having a wiki that shows who is supporting it, but that's really all we're doing. It's just a wiki without any real significance. It'd be cool to show where people can go to actually help and make a difference.

2007-04-28 [Byne]: I'm about to add a bunch of links to differenat organizations. I'm acctually hoping to go to Thailnad next year on a reef conservation project. I'm also trying to get ahold fo Rob Stewart. :3

2007-04-30 [~username~]: Cool! I hope you have fun! I defidently think we should do more to help.

2007-04-30 [Byne]: I've been doing a lot od research on shark attacks and such.. And every single death is not caused by the shark "eating" the victim, but insufficient medical care.

2007-08-28 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: not to mention, every time a shark has the misfortune to bite a human (because most only get bitten, not eaten), we go ballistic and kill hundreds of the poor beasts. such beautiful creatures.

2007-08-28 [Ramirez]: Yes, the human race is rather arrogant and insane. Kind of a bad mix.

2007-08-28 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: i was kinda irked after Steve Irwin died, people started massacring stingrays.... well, first of all, that wont bring him back, second, he would never, never in his life have condoned such blind and senseless actions, third, if i had my guess, he wanted (like most people) to die happy, doing something he loved doing, teaching the world.

2007-08-28 [Ramirez]: I know, that was awful. I can't believe people actually went out and did that. I was absolutely flabbergasted. At first I thought it was just a sick unfunny joke, but then it was all over the news and I was like, "Are you serious? Are these people retarded?" ><;; Humanity never ceases to disappoint me.

2007-08-28 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: yeah, if only the sharks did eat some people, unfortunately it's never the right people. I think Irwin would have been mad had he known what people did after he died. i would have been.

2007-08-28 [Ramirez]: I'm sure he would be absolutely appalled and disgusted. =/

2007-08-29 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: probably turning over in his grave. did he teach these people nothing?

2007-08-29 [Ramirez]: Some people are obviously incompetent morons. It can't be helped.

2007-08-30 [Byne]: I don't think a shark has ever eaten and entire person. A whole limb perhaps, but not an entire person.

The shark population has declined by over 90% in the past decade due to shark finning, which is explained in the documentary Sharkwater.

Every single species of shark is endangered, yet none of them are protected. Not even the majestic whale shark is protected, and they are completely harmless.

I'm getting a shark tattoo. 8D

2007-08-30 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: i like sharks. i'm guilty of eating shark steak on rare occassions, but i don't condone the wholesale slaughter of any species (except maybe people...) shark by-products appear in numerous things aside from soup and pills, including makeup, and some of the fish-liver-oils that don't specify the kind of fish. their teeth end up in souvenir shops, and their embryo's in little glass jars alongside them.

2007-08-31 [Byne]: Not all shark teeth come from hunted sharks and such. I have a shark tooth ecklace I made from a tooth I found after a shark dive in the Bahamas with my brother.

2007-08-31 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: many are washed up on shore, and shed naturally, but just as many are taken from sharks while alive... when they kill the sharks fore their fins, many times, teeth are collected too (and a couple other organs) but largely, the rest of the shark is dumped back into the ocean. i was on a vacation in Florida before i moved here, and watched these yacht-owning fishermen catching sharks, finning them, carving out their jaws and teeth, then dumping the mutilated carcasses back into the swimming area of the campground we were staying at.

2007-09-01 [Byne]: Yep. That is what happens. v_v Saddens me greatly.

2007-09-03 [Byne]: I just saw an incredibly disturbing advertisment on television. There is actually a convention and competition for catching sharks in the USA. The ad was on Spike TV. I semi-vomited in my mouth.

The sharks were portrayed as man-eating killers of whom we have no choice to kill before they kill us. God, humans sicken me. Men in particular, seeing as how generally speaking, it is men who participate in these testosterone-filled hunting games. ._.

2007-09-03 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: i presume they are, as usually, trying to make up for something. why don't they instead beat up the people who are doing it? it's just as macho in the end, and better for the sharks. and sharks really don't like people... and when we trespass in their domain, we have no choice but to play by their rules.

If only people had enough humility to admit that even though we are at the top of the food chain, we are not exempt from it.

I have never held an animal responsible for an injury it inflicted on, me, because in most cases, when an animal hurts/kills a person, it's the person's fault.

2007-09-03 [Byne]: Yup.

2007-11-13 [meme138567]: i think if people would stop throwing trash in the oceans there would be an increase in the population.

2007-11-14 [Byne]: Hell, people need to stop polluting our air as well. o_o

Biggest threat to sharks at the moment = humans over fishing them for no REASON. RAWR. -Gets angry at the people who kill sharks.-

2008-02-19 [Tickle Me Emo]: We've discussed the impact of sharks on the marine ecosystem in my Marine Bio class a lot, and how when they attack humans it's usually just to test whether or not they're edible. Strangely enough, the great white shark isn't the most dangerous to humans. There are much greater incidences of bull shark attacks than great white attacks. Part of that has to do with where the animals feed, but also how aggresive the shark species are.

But the wiki also mentions the conservation of skates and rays, and I thought I might throw out some random trivia... the giant "scallops" that you typically see for sale in grocery stores, etc. aren't necessarily scallops, so much as a round section removed from the fins of a certain species of rays.

Oh, and the whole issue about shark cartilage pills/powder has kind of died off. The pills were really popular when people found out that sharks are very resistant to cancer and other diseases. Capitalists just took advantage of the brief frenzy, but once people realized that whatever repulsed the cancer didn't necessarily exist within the sharks' cartilage, the demand kind of died off.

2008-02-19 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: well, that explains why only certain kinds of "scallops" make me sick, and others do not. I have a shellfish allergy and was puzzled by this for the longest time. the smaller "bay scallops" make me violently sick, while the larger ones don't bother me at all....

2008-02-19 [Tickle Me Emo]: That's probably because they're not what you think they are :P
Kind of weird, no?
But I am sure it's not the universal truth. I'd still be careful...

2008-02-19 [Byne]: Ah...My dad was telling me the story of one of his collegues who went into the fish market in Tokyo, which I think is the largest in the world.

The guy walks into one store and gets confused, because huge steaks are hanging and on display. He was wondering what beef was doing in a fish market. It wasn't fish. It was whale and dolphin. And some shark.

2008-02-20 [Tickle Me Emo]: I thought sharks were considered fish?
But Japanese tend to rely on seafood to make a living. I mean, the fishing of sharks and other endangered species should be allowable, as long as overfishing isn't occurring. Consuption should ideally be lower than reproduction until species return to their pre-fishing numbers, and then the two should be equal.

2008-02-20 [Byne]: Mhm, sharks are fish. But it was mostly whale and dolphin in this store.
Most Japanese don't actually eat whale or dolphin. However, the wa the kill them, is not only illegal, but inhumane. Almost 70% of the worlds fisheries have already collapsed. And countries are unwilling to cut down the amounts of fish that they catch.

2008-02-20 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: of course, too much profit in it yet. Businesses don't give a rats @$$ about conservation, only about how much money they earn. And so long as there are fish in the sea (and river, lakes and streams, etc) fisheries will continue to abuse them. It would be nice if all fisheries converted to ranching, growing captive populations so as not to endanger the wild ones, but that takes a lot of money to start up, and the running expense is exponentially larger than that of a typical fishing business. They won't do that until they have to, and only then as a last resort.

2008-02-20 [Tickle Me Emo]: But currently there are some issues with fish farming, especially at open aquaculture sites. They tend to breed parasites, diseases, and other problems. Not only does this pose health risks to the farmed fish and the people who consume the meat, but it can spread to wild fish that pass within the viscinity. There's this one place in British Columbia where the migratory path of wild salmon passes right by a farm, and they expect the wild salmon population to be decimated within the next couple years.

But then the farms treat the fish with antibiotics, which can also spread to wild populations as well as cause an increase in antibiotic resistance in humans who eat the farmed fish.

So although it might be a good idea to decrease the impact of overfishing, farm fishing methods should probably be refined a little better before we rely on them entirely, especially as they still have a negative impact on wild populations. I know the human demand for fish usually swings toward wild fish. And it's actually pretty easy to tell the difference, because apparently there's food dye in the diet of the farmed fish in order for their flesh to look more appealing in the supermarket. So wild fish actually look paler and (ostensibly) less appealing :p
At least, that's what I heard.

2008-02-21 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: That would make sense, and it would be another expense that would up the cost of farming as well. Antibiotics are almost always a bad thing in agriculture, hence the demand for "100% organic" foods. I think the issue with farming is the sheer number of fish being kept in smaller confines (ponds), usually not running water, essentially sitting around in their own refuse. I seriously doubt many of them filter the water, and that's probably where the antibiotics come into play, as well as other water conditioners and chemicals intended to clean the water in unnatural ways. Because they aren't directly consumed by humans, many of those chemicals may not be regulated by USDA, or FDA, or any similar organizations.

2008-02-21 [Byne]: Ah, Tickle me basically got the main issue there.
you do get the few fishermen who will respect fishing quotas, and restrictions, but there is a need for international agreements. For example, Canada has put a restriction on fishing soho (a type of salmon). However, these are migratory species who often spawn off the coast of Alaska, where they're fished out by the Americans.

And farmed fish = evil. Or rather, farmed salmon = evil.
The fish are not only suseptable to disease, parasites and other issues that involve being kept in small quarters with more fish, but are often genetically modified. The also have a higher fat content, and are less healthy.

And Monochrome, no such thing as 100% organic. The amount of pollutants in the air, the land, and the water, has essentially contaminated every single thing on the planet.

Something interesting --> Sharks are being fished to replace swordfish and other large sail-fish, as there have been new restrictions placed on swordfish. However, there are next to none in regards to sharks.

2008-02-21 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: I don't follow that "organic" junk, but if you notice on the shelves of grocery stores, you see more of it, and there's a lot of demand for the stuff, even though it's outrageously priced. It never fails to amuse me that the "organic" stuff, ice cream for example, is simply the same thing with less ingredients. People are paying extra to have things left out (often preservatives). Sounds backwards until you think about the percentage of their crop the farmers have to sacrifice for abstaining from pesticides.

of course, sharks are man-eating monsters, didn't ya know?
not to mention, sharks, as with other animals, are often killed as a by-product of tuna nets, and tend to be persecuted by the ignorant populace, all in addition to heavy fishing.

Typically, I don't eat fish unless I caught it myself, the good old fashioned way with a rod & reel. Then you know how fresh it is too.

2008-02-21 [Tickle Me Emo]: There are some international agreements in place, such as one protecting a certain species of kelp popular in Japanese cuisine that is harvested off the Alaskan coast, I believe. But still, international cooperation is woefully underemphasized (and I believe it's coho salmon... at least, it probably is if you're talking Alaskan salmon).

The concept of fish farming isn't bad, it just needs to be refined. Fish farming applies to more than just salmon. There are several species that are bred explicitly for eating, and all are susceptible to diseases that occur in that environment.
(and swordfish is actually really good to eat <.< >.>)

Well, preservatives are actually pretty bad for you, so I can understand why people would pay extra for products without them. And when people advertise using the phrase "100% organic," they probably mean that the product was farmed without any pesticides, but don't necessarily refer to byproducts of the environment (or even neighboring farms that do use pesticides).

2008-02-21 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: Organic usually just means pesticide free, but many companies extend it to mean nothing unnatural was involved in the process. no growth hormones in milk, etc etc, no preservatives. USDA/FDA has specific guidelines as to what exactly can be labeled as "organic" (I'd have to look that one up) also, many of those pesticides leave residue in the soil for many years (sometimes fifteen, twenty years or more) that may still be contaminating foods in fields that have not used pesticides for many years.

makes me wonder if the farmed fish diseases are ones that the fish naturally get in the wild, that are concentrated because of their living conditions, or are they a direct result of a captive lifestyle? Many animals have health problems only when in captivity (much of it a result of inbreeding) which is sure to be happening to some degree in the confines of fish farming ponds. Or of it is all related to the stagnance of the water, and living in ones own filth.

2008-02-21 [Tickle Me Emo]: I was under the impression that the diseases that occur in farmed fish can also be found in the wild, only exacerbated due to the conditions of the farm.

You can find out pretty much anything you want to know about organic products from this site and its links:
http://www.usda.gov/wps/portal/!ut/p/_s.7_0_A/7_0_1OB?navid=ORGANIC_CERTIFICATIO&;navtype=RT&amp;parentnav=AGRICULTURE

2008-02-21 [Byne]: Ah, I wasn't speaking against organics, as it is better for the environment, if done in a sustainable manner. My family eats a lot of organic food, and a lot of local produce whenever possible. We grow our own herbs and tomatoes in the summer.

Swordfish is good to eat. I've eaten it. It isn't until recently that I've seriously cut down on my fish intake.

And yes, I meant coho. XD

2008-02-21 [Tickle Me Emo]: My mom is pretty stingy, so organic/locally grown products... not so much. Except apples, because I live in Washington XD
Also being a Seattleite, fish is a pretty big part of my diet. It is better for you than other meats, can be cheaper, and typically tastes better. It also means I really know my salmon, so no worries, Robine :P

I'm aware that my eating habits may not directly reflect my beliefs in terms of fishing problems. I will admit I'm a hypocrite. But it's kind of like the carbon emissions from cars problem - a lot of people can't afford hybrid/electric cars, and although they're aware that their driving habits are harmful to the environment, until alternative methods become more readily available, they still have to get around!

2008-02-22 [Byne]: Ah. See, my mum is the reason I'm a proud eco-freak. 8D

I've tried to make my eating habits reflect my beliefs. I don't eat red meat, rarel ever eat bacon...I eat chicken, and will eat fish. I typically try to eat only locall caught fish....But being in Ontario, that gets hard. However, whenever I'm out in BC (where I am originally from) I eat the wild, fresh caught salmon.

I had someone try to convince me that cattle farming wasn't as evil as farming fruits and veggies. o:

And, I will say right now, that I will NEVER eat dolphin or whale. x:

2008-02-22 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: I can't say I notice a difference between organic and normal foods when I eat them, but I guess it's all in the conscience. Many of those pesticides have harmful impacts on wildlife that may not be noticed for a year or more after their use! And while we ban ones like DDT here, many countries in S. America, where we import a lot of our fruits and veggies from, have not banned them.

as far as eating meat: I'll try anything once, but I'm picky. Fish is better for you, especially smaller fish (lower mercury content) but I rarely eat anything that has been dead more than an hour, so my experiences are few and far between. If I can smell it from more than 3 feet away, it's not fresh enough. I have nothing against the consumption of fish, even shark, my issue is that they aren't being used in a sustainable manner. But that applies to everything. Trees, fossil fuels, etc.

even if we can't afford hybrid cars, I feel a lot better about driving my little two-door coupe with good gas mileage than a gas-guzzling SUV or Truck, and with the better mileage, Gas is more affordable, my tank lasts longer. That's good enough for me for now. I don't think I could afford to put gas in something that big.

There are a lot of things that need reform, and sadly I doubt we will see it in our lifetime. There are a lot of sustainable resources and alternatives that are being largely ignored, and like all new things, would require a significant investment to get them started, but that investment would recap it's cost very quickly. I'll try to dig up the article I'm thinking of.

2008-02-22 [Tickle Me Emo]: I actually don't eat that much meat in general, although I do have chicken relatively often.

The consumtion of whale always brings up the issue of Native American hunting rights. There would never be issues, however, if consumption never exceeded a species' ability to regenerate its population. It's like income and expenditure, but unfortunately people have gotten used to credit card debt, and just keep getting further and further into debt... and if you extend the metaphor, things look pretty depressing, lol

2008-02-22 [Byne]: Ah, but the issues of whales in which I speak is in regards to the Japanese and Norwegians. Who are whaling illegally, going against an international moritorium. In Australia, a group of natives view Migaloo (a white humpback whale) as a part of their culture. The Japanese whaling fleet stated that if the came across Migaloo, the would kill him.

There was a case last year where a group of hunters from a Native tribe took over 5 hours to kill a grey whale that the did not have permission to kill. These men used unethical, untraditional methods, and essentially tortured the whale. They where taken to court, and I believe the leader was charged with a felony.

I don't object to native hunting, as it is most often done for tradition, and they do not waste any part of the animal.

Monochrome, a recent stud came out in Britain about the difference between organic and non-organic foods. For fruit and veggies, the organic ones had more nutrients, while organic milk and meat had less bad fats, and more nutrients as well.

I live in South America for several years when I was youngers. And it is true, that man companies (Like Del Monte and Dole) still use banned pesticides like DDTS. In Costa Rica, for example, the pineapple plantations fire their workers every three months then rehire them, so that the company doesn't have to pay medical benefits. The pesticides in use are known carcinogens.

I tend to walk, cycle, or take public transportation whenever I can, or car pool.

And I'm heading for the Environmental Sciences for University, and I hope I can make a difference in Canada, and the world, in regards to environmental issues. :3

2008-02-22 [Byne]: Sorry for all the typos. M y key doesn't work, so I have to copy and paste it in whenever it is needed, and I often forget to do so.

2008-02-22 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that organic things did have more nutrients, because pesticides are so damaging to the ecosystem as a whole. Many plants and animals are beneficial to farmers (Like ladybugs who eat aphids, and worms that fertilize the soil) pesticides just kill everything, good or bad, so a lot of things are farmed in nutrient-poor soil, and the mass farming further reduces the nutritional value. that makes a lot of sense, [Byne]

2008-02-22 [Byne]: It does. But the whole issue is that these mass farmers don't want people to find out that organic food is actually better for you.

Its like, ten years ago, when a female scientist stated and produced a report on how bad trans-fatty acids where for people. All the big companies sued her, and totally shut her down.

Same issue with fishing. People think that there is still too much of a profit on fish to cut down. Do they not realize that if the amounts of fish caught was to be reduced, they could charge more, make more money...And be able to make a profit in the future?

2008-02-22 [Tickle Me Emo]: It's all about supply and demand... the problem is that fish isn't exactly a commodity, so if the price goes too high, people won't buy it. All businesses related to the fishing industry would get really mad and suffer extensively. There's a certain point where the fishing industry would not gain a profit, and seeing how the industry has existed for a very long time, they have probably established the highest balancing point possible.

2008-02-23 [Byne]: Thats true...But talking to a lot of fishermen, I found it interesting to learn that the smaller, local fishermen abide by the regulations. They also try to make sure to only bring in male crabs for example, as you only need one male to fertilize a ton of female crabs. o:

A lot of people have the assumption that anything they could do to help the environment would have no effect. But that isn't true. Dx

2008-02-23 [Tickle Me Emo]: When you have a relatively small catch, I imagine it is easier (and more convenient) to abide by regulations. NOT that I am defending commercial fishing and its methods, I'm just pointing out reasons.

If every one person did something, no matter the size or the impact, to help the environment every day, that's billions of people across the globe doing something. Any one act would be compounded to an effect larger than the individual deeds. So if everybody shortened their shower by a minute, think of the water that could be saved.

2008-02-23 [Byne]: I switched the shower head on my shower, so I save... 120 0000 gallons of water a year, or so. Also, having a cooler shower is not only better for your skin and hair, but it conserves energy. :3

Also, birth control is having affects on fish and marine life, believe it or not. o:

2008-02-23 [Tickle Me Emo]: Frequently hotels will use water-saving showerheads in order to conserve water and thus save money :)

Birth control, huh?

2008-02-23 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: birth control? how does that work?

2008-02-24 [Byne]: As you should know, most places in the world don't have the greatest water treatment programs. In some areas, they don't even screen the water that gets pumped back into the ocean or lakes, etc.

The chemicals in birth control aren't always broken down by the person who's taking it, and those chemicals get passed out into the water system. When untreated, they can have a negative affect on a fishes breeding cycle, and the eggs they lay.

I'm sure it has a heavier affect on the mammals though. o: Its one more thing that can accumilate in their body. X;

2008-02-24 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: nice. so we're putting lots of estrogen in the water, and it's putting a damper on breeding where it's exposed.

2008-02-24 [Tickle Me Emo]: How big of a problem is that? I mean, I imagine in areas where water treatment isn't the greatest (or is nonexistent), birth control wouldn't necessarily be readily available, either...

2008-02-24 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: true, but even here in the US, where almost 25% of women take it, water treatment is less than perfect. and many areas may not have regulations about how thorough the job must be done. I visited a water treatment plant where i used to teach at a nature center, and the water they return to the source smells the same as id did when it came to the plant.

2008-02-24 [Tickle Me Emo]: I remember my marine bio teacher talking about water treatment... I don't think smell has anything to do with how appropriately treated the water is... Although typically the treated water they release is much more nutrient-rich than typical sea water, so there are a bunch of problems with plankton blooms, which affects the availability of light, etc. etc...

2008-02-24 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: well, it didn't look like they had done anything but remove the solids from it, which doesn't do a lot in the long run. regulations are pretty loose about how clean the water must be before it can be released.

2008-02-25 [Byne]: Ah, in areas of Canada, sewage is pumped into the ocean untreated. So in countries where water treatment (good treatment) is accessible and affordable...And they aren't doing it.... Yeah. Get my drift here?

I'm actually in the midsts of filming a documentary on water use and treatment. I'm about to go in and tour the water treatment plant here, in my town. I'm also talking to a hydroengineer....Or something similar. Can't remember the full name.

Its pure stupidity that is brining us to contaminate the small amount of fresh water we have. Hell, every country on the planet is currently dealing with shortages, even us. And we have the most fresh water in the world. Dx

2008-02-25 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: well, i bet the filter manufacturers are loving it. the dirtier our water gets, the more filters they sell to us so we can clean it up.

2008-02-25 [Byne]: Ah, but its getting to the point that what we're putting in the water is incredibly difficult to take out. x____o

2008-02-25 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: eventually, we'll learn. it might take a few defective babies, but we'll learn. Its just s shame the kids will have to pay for their another person's idiocy

2008-02-26 [Byne]: We are all going to pay for our own retarded actions. The chemicals we're putting into our bodies are not good. Why do you think the amount of cancer cases has risen so much?

Good news though. The Japanese whaling fleet down in the Southern seas hasn't been able to kill any whales for three days now. 83

2008-02-27 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: some countries never were good at conservation.

2008-02-27 [Tickle Me Emo]: I don't think it's limited to "countries"...

2008-02-27 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: people in general. some countries show more aptitude for conservation. Hawaii, before the invasion of the white man, knew conservation well. China hes never cared much if a species goes extinct. there are many endangered, and critically endangered species that are protected by weak and unenforced laws. a lot of animals still are poached for traditional Chinese remedies.

2008-02-27 [Byne]: I'd say its humanity on the whole.

They say that greed and hoarding and the likes are signs of greater intelligent. And for all our brains, we're turning into the grasshoppers who eat themselves to death. x___o

To me, the animals who only take what they need are WAY smarter than we are. I feel guilty all the time for the amount of things I buy that I don't need. v___v

2008-02-27 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: in Hawaii, there was a bird, and like most animals living on small island ecosystems, their existence is precarious at best. before the invasion of the white man, the birds thrived. They were also valued by the natives for their feathers, which were used to make cloaks for the Hawaiian royalty. rather than killing the birds, they captured them, took only one feather from each bird, then released them. The birds have since gone extinct, It is called the Hawaiian O'o (Moho nobilis) and went extinct in/around 1934.

2008-02-28 [Tickle Me Emo]: I would say it's modern humanity that is the primary culprit. There have always been certain people who have blended into the natural ecosystem, and I wouldn't say that none exist today. They just seem to be fewer. A lot fewer.

But it's all kinda like the Matrix, I think it's the second one, where Agent Smith is talking to a drugged Morpheus about humans being a virus... consuming all the resources an area has to offer before moving on. Good mind games, haha

2008-02-28 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: how accurate that is. it wasn't a problem when there were fewer of us, but with procreation as popular as it is, i guess parasite or tumor are good words to describe the species.

2008-02-29 [Byne]: Ah, on the topic of sharks.... 6 more species have been added to the Red List, some listed at the possible endangerment. The hammerhead, to be precise.

Also, the amount of shark attacks has risen over the past year, but due to human activity in the ocean, not because of sharks.

2008-02-29 [Tickle Me Emo]: I read on the NOAA site a while ago that shark attacks were less common than electrocutions due to Christmas lights. I've heard a lot of stats like that (which are often false), but you'd think NOAA would get it right...

The hammerhead is a really interesting shark... before my marine bio class, I didn't know it was one of only a few sharks that eat other sharks. Ignorant American that I am, haha

2008-02-29 [Byne]: Yep. Tiger, hammerhead and.....I can't remember the others. Not many though.

So....The world population is over 6.6 billion people. BILLION. And there were 71 shark attacks last year. Only 6% of those where fatal. So......Sharks bite 70 people a year....And we kill 200 million of them....

2008-02-29 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: yeah. that never made much sense to me. If I got bit by a shark, chances are, it was my fault (And I wouldn't blame the shark for doing it, any more than i would blame people for breathing). people forget that we are creatures that belong on land. we have neither fins nor gills, but i guess we think that if we are going to rape the planet, we might as well do a thorough job.

2008-03-01 [Tickle Me Emo]: Well, considering that we have actually explored an inifinitesimally small portion of the Earth's oceans, we thankfully haven't been all that thorough. Yet.

I've been trying to find reliable sources for statistics on sharks, especially in regards to attacks, but it's been hard because a lot of sites are complete bogus. Does anybody have a good source or two? Any media.

Did you hear about this researcher who was filming a show on bull sharks for a Shark Week, and when he was discussing how unlikely it was to be bitten by the sharks (even though they are one of the most aggressive species, especially towards humans) he got bitten in the calf. Which was incredibly ironic. But the point is, he was invading the environment in which creatures besides ourselves are more comfortable and (quite frankly) more dominant. The nice thing was they pointed that out in the program.

2008-03-01 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: yeah, but people will still only see what they want to see, and with so much misinformation about, they never will know the truth.

2008-03-01 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: i wish i did have some statistics for you, I can look in a book i have, encyclopedia of fishes....

hmm, "each year 30 people (worldwide I'm assuming) are killed by sharks, and people kill 700,000 tonnes / 771,400 tons of sharks and rays.

2008-03-01 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: the book is Encyclopedia of Fishes second edition, published in 1998 by Fog City Press. i can get the rest of the info you need for proper citation, if you like.

2008-03-01 [Tickle Me Emo]: No, no, I just want some reliable sources I can do some research. Education is essential after all. People listen to you much more when you are knowledgeable and have (appropriate) statistics. I'm taking a stats class this year, so I'm becoming increasingly able to accept or refute, and some of the stats I've seen in some sources are just plain awful.
Problem is... remembering statistics is definitely not my strong point :P

2008-03-01 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: that and many of them could be easily.... slaughtered. I could say something like "So and So is the #1 New York times bestselling author" (I work in a bookstore) and many books have that printed on the cover, by several different authors. and all of them are NYT bestselling authors. I wondered at the use of the word "The" Singular. They are usually referring to a single week or two that they topped the charts.

2008-03-01 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: stats are twisted a lot. Hopefully, you'll be able to decipher the more truthful ones from the ones that have been mutilated for personal gain.

2008-03-01 [Tickle Me Emo]: That is one of the reasons I took the class. It has a direct application to life outside a math major, haha... it can be used in the context of sharks, even.
But the whole bestselling author scenario isn't about statistics, it's about claims, but both should be under equal scrutiny, and oftentimes statistics are included in claims, or the two overlap.

2008-03-01 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: it was just one example of how information can be skewed.

another would be the stats concerning what percentage of Americans are overweight. They never tell you what their basis is for establishing those parameters, or what scale is used to measure it. you know what i mean.

2008-03-01 [Byne]: If you want reliable information on shark attacks, I'd recommend you check out the International Shark Attack File.

I've seen that clip. That was a provoked attack, as they had baited the water to attract the sharks. It was his own stupidity that got him bitten. >_<

There are only around 5 unprovoked attacks each year. Most of the others reported are almost completely the humans fault. And generally, fatalities occur when sufficeint medical attention is not given to the victim.

2008-03-01 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: Was boating in the gulf once, and saw another boat throwing chum in just before sending their divers in. I thought it was a bit ludicrous. We were going to do some diving that day, but decided to put some distance between ourselves and the idiot boat. I've swam with wild sharks and rays, and they have never bothered me. People just have to remember to be respectful of them.

2008-03-01 [Tickle Me Emo]: Speaking of being respectful, an 18' great white was just caught off the coast of my home state. The guys who caught it were actually fishing for other sharks. If I'm not mistaken, it was killed for a trophy. Which is a bit ludicrous, if you ask me.

2008-03-01 [Byne]: ...Great whites are always tagged as horrible creatures. Its one of my goals in life to dive with them. <3

I know that its common for there to be shark fishing competitions in Florida. .-.

I've been on a cage-free shark dive where they baited the water. Nowever, the area we were in only attracts reef sharks, and on RARE occasion, a tiger. I was surrounded by over 40 sharks that were 3-7 feet long. It was an amazing experiance. FOund a few teeth after it too. 8D

2008-03-02 [Tickle Me Emo]: That does sound amazing... if there's any shark I want to dive with most, it's the whale shark. They are so amazing, but there is so little known about them.

2008-03-02 [Byne]: -Flails her arms around.- I might have the opportunity to dive with them. <3 I'm flying to Thailand to work on a marine conservation project, and the most common shark species there is the leopard shark, and it is one of the best places to spot whale sharks. -Spasms.-

2008-03-03 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: trophy hunters...ugh. Hunting for food is one thing, and i believe that everything in the animal that can be used should be. Killing for trophies just irritates me to no end.

Jealous, [Byne] promise to take a lot of pictures an bring back to ET!

2008-03-03 [Byne]: I will. I just bought a digital camera with under water housing so I can get pictures when I'm diving. Hoping to get some shots of leopard sharks, I am. :3

2008-03-04 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: I can't wait to see!

2008-03-04 [Tickle Me Emo]: I am majorly jealous! I imagine a good photo might make a great banner... 0.0

2008-03-04 [Byne]: Exactly what I was thinking. 8D
I'm off to Hawaii this week, so I'll be back with some good pictures, I hope. 8D

2008-04-09 [Trist]: i'll support this cos im an environmentalist. animals = love.

2008-04-10 [Byne]: Sharks = <3 love. XD

2008-04-10 [Trist]: sharks = animals,  man this is like math in motion!

2008-04-10 [Tickle Me Emo]: Environment = love, but
Environment doesn't = animals. Necessarily.

2008-04-10 [Trist]: of course  sharks --> animals  but  animals -/-> sharks. just want to clarify that.

2008-04-10 [Ramirez]: -flails about- I see equations, and = signs. -cries and hides-

2008-04-10 [Tickle Me Emo]: As long as it's not *, +, or a division sign, I'm good, haha

2008-04-10 [Trist]: sharks / animals = environmentalism ^ love?  i'm makin this shit up.

2008-04-10 [Trist]: lol, ^love.

2008-04-10 [Ramirez]: -brain explodes-

2008-04-10 [Tickle Me Emo]: Nah, I think it would be more like animals^sharks + environmentalism = love

I think (animals^sharks) would be a pretty powerful figure, although (animals^sharks) < love.

2008-04-10 [Byne]: XD XDDD........... -Giggle snort.-

Sharks+animals+environment = Happy robine.

2008-04-10 [Trist]: at any rate, we've got the numbers. the math says save the sharks motherfucker.

2008-04-10 [Tickle Me Emo]: Yes, but unfortunately detrimental shark activity = $
So, really, it's how this equation pans out that decides whether sharks are saved or not:

shark hunting >/=/< environmentalism

Because people who run shark businesses are typically wealthy, and, let's face it... environmentalists? Not so much. In this capitalistic society, money wins out. What group has the brains, on the other hand, is another issue entirely :P

2008-04-10 [Trist]: yeah, but if you can show them that activities like diving with sharks can be a profitable business venture, not only = $ but also maintaining the shark population can = more $ in the long run.

2008-04-10 [Tickle Me Emo]: I have no doubt maintaining strong shark populations would prove lucrative on many levels, it's just overcoming big, established businesses that is the problem. If shark hunting were to be curtailed, not only would it increase shark numbers (and therefore provide more opportunities for shark-related activities), but it would also reduce the supply of shark products, which would increase the price of the products and bring in a larger profit. However, such ideas struggle against years of predefined shark industry convictions and a resentment of people toward the ostensible aggression of sharks that, unfortunately, still lingers.

2008-04-11 [Byne]: ...At least half of the shakr finning that occurs, is actually illegal. But Tickle is right. A lot fo people could careless about sharks because they see them as frightning, evil creatures, even though on 0.2% of the less than 70 attacks each year are fatal, and almost all of the attacks are provoked attacks. On average, there are only 5 unprovoked attacks, and people need to remember that htere are over 6.6 billion persons on the planet. Over 3 billion of them have access to waters inhabited by sharks.

2008-04-11 [Tickle Me Emo]: I think there's a lot of exaggeration about how much people dislike sharks, though. It may just be that I live in environmentally-conscious Seattle, but I've never really encountered people who are scared of sharks I know that people are, but at least in the area I live in, it's not that common of a sentiment.

And industries don't have to be legal to have supremacy <.< >.> 0.0

2008-04-11 [Trist]: i bet there's more dog attacks, and people love dogs. and i KNOW there are way more human attacks. if you want an animal to be scared of, man, HUMANS, they are fucking vicious.

2008-04-11 [Tickle Me Emo]: Yeah, but when was the last time you heard about a human having a serious relationship with a shark? Humans are dangerous to other humans, but at least they're nice as well.

2008-04-11 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: I saw an exhibit at a zoo once, it was in a building, behind a curtain. Above the curtain was a plaque that said "Most dangerous animal on earth" behind the curtain was a mirror.

2008-04-11 [Tickle Me Emo]: BAHAHA! That is so funny, but not... >.<

2008-04-11 [Trist]: thats so perfect and so true.

2008-04-11 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: I always ask the kids at the zoo where I work what they think the most dangerous animal on earth is. I get very typical answers. Tigers. Sharks. etc. Though I did have (honest to god) one kid tell me Prairie Dogs, are indeed the most dangerous animal on earth (more dangerous than a great white shark, which could very well be true... I despise rodents.) they are all very surprised when I try to hint to them that I'm surrounded by this very dangerous animal. Then the guesses become: "Squirrel?" "Fire Ants?"

2008-04-12 [Tickle Me Emo]: I imagine that the answer could vary depending on your definition of "danger."

2008-04-12 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: true. If I was allergic to bees, that would certainly be a logical answer.

2008-04-17 [Dark Side of the Moon]: Hi all! Not to hijack the conversation or anything, but I've been watching this wiki for a while now and decided to make a tiny contribution to it if I may. http://www.elasmodiver.com/sharkive%20index.htm#Shark%20Families and http://www.shark-pictures.com/ have lots of photos of lovely sharks if anyone would like to see them. 

Now, back on subject: in my opinion the common domestic cat is the world's most dangerous and deadliest animal. Why? Most animals hunt and kill out of necessity in order to eat. Domestic cats kill for the fun of it. Anything they can catch they usually destroy and oftentimes just leave it after its dead without taking any bites from it. Cat = deadly

2008-04-17 [Trist]: human behaviour rubbing off on our pets.

2008-04-17 [Tickle Me Emo]: Domestic cats are truly vile, and I don't think it's due to their owners' behavior. I mean, dogs aren't evil. Just cats.

2008-04-18 [Trist]: can i just say, lets all not call any kind of animal 'evil'? remember what page you are on.

2008-04-18 [Tickle Me Emo]: But they're cats T.T
Besides, domestic cats will hardly find themselves in need of protection any time soon.

2008-04-18 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: no, they reproduce faster than even they can keep up with. poor feral mongrels. I love cats. I have to laugh though, every time i take my python anywhere, and people ask me if it's dangerous. They are always surprised when I tell them their dog is more dangerous than my python. (1- it can carry more zoonotic diseases than my snake, 2- it's bite has far more capability to inflict injury 3- it's much easier to manhandle if it does get pissy) not to mention they eat less. a lot less.

2008-04-18 [Tickle Me Emo]: It always makes me laugh when in the videos they feel the need to point out that snakes aren't slimy because they aren't amphibians. But snakes are almost so smooth that they feel like they do have some sort of mucus coating...

I'm allergic to cats. I think that's a good enough reason to dislike them. Allergies, combined with a personality that seems to be shared by most gives an even greater reason. But there are sweet cats, of course. But I find myself making an exception for the sweet cats, unlike dogs, where I make exceptions for the mean ones.

2008-04-18 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: snakes are not at all slimy, though depending on the snake, they are indeed very smooth and plasticky. some have very rough, or keeled, scales, like the arafura file snake, named for the texture of it's skin.

2008-04-18 [Tickle Me Emo]: Yeah, I guess "plasticky" is the sort of word I was looking for. Not that goopy sort of slimy, but the slick feeling.
It's hard for a non-snake-owner like me to describe stuff like that o.0

2008-04-18 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: there is a simple solution to that. get a snake ;)

2008-04-18 [Byne]: Snakes are love. But sharks are teh pwn. XD

Sharks have very sandpapery skin. Certain sharks, if you rub your hand along them the wrong way fast enough, it'll cut you. o:

2008-04-18 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: yeah, I've felt some, in petting pools. plus snakes are much easier to keep. though I'd love to have a big saltwater tank for sharks someday.... I don't think I'll ever be that rich.

2008-04-18 [Byne]: -Nods.- I'll have to make myself happy by diving with them. e_____e

2008-04-19 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: i Should find out where near here I can do that... I live in Florida, for goodness sake.

2008-04-19 [Byne]: ....o_____________o I live in Ontario, several hundred miles form any ocean. ;-;
I did my shark div ein the Bahamas though. Stuart's Cove. Yup, yup. It was amazing. :3

2008-04-20 [Tickle Me Emo]: I live in a decent diving area, but not too many sharks :(

2008-04-21 [Byne]: Aw. I kinda wish I lived nearer to a diving place. Even if I lived on the coast in Canada, it'd be cold water dives. x:

2008-04-21 [Tickle Me Emo]: Yeah, that's pretty much all you get in Seattle, too :P

2008-04-21 [Byne]: Where I live in the summer (o occasion) they have six gill sharks. 8D Freaky looking things.

2008-05-22 [Trist]: check this out: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/7413948.stm

2008-05-22 [Tickle Me Emo]: I got to see footage of the Giant Pacific Octopus attacking the dogshark the other day in my marine bio class. Just thought I'd put that out there.

2008-05-23 [Byne]: Well, I'm in Thailand right now. 8D Haven't seen any sharks here, diving or on the menu, which is good. I'm hoping to see a few leopard sharks and [possibly a whale shark while I'm here.

2008-05-23 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: If you see a whale shark, get some pics for us!

2008-05-25 [Byne]: I will. -Holds up her underwater housing.- I got some wicked shots of some lionfish. :3

2008-05-26 [The Monochrome Rainbow]: i can't wait to see those either if ever you feel like sharing

2008-05-29 [Byne]: Y'all will have to wait as my only access to internet is at a cafe in downtown Ao Nang. I pay per minute. x:

Saw a kuhl's ray, crested sea snake, and some wicked giant clams. And a crown of thorns starfish. Still no shark. ):

2008-06-04 [Avatar15]: This wiki makes me happy. C: I didn't expect I'd ever find one like this here on elftown, but I'm glad there is one.<3

2008-06-04 [Byne]: Sharks are teh love. I need to make a Scuba Divers wiki.... o:

2008-06-04 [Avatar15]: O: Have you gone swimming with them?

2008-06-05 [Trist]: "wicked giant" ...you have no idea how wrong that sounds to me.

2008-06-06 [Byne]: Swimming with sharks? Psssht.. I've dived with sharks. :) It was amazing.

2008-06-06 [Avatar15]: I consider diving swimming. :P Same. It is. <3

2008-06-07 [Byne]: Diving = more complicated than swimming and easier to injure/be killed while doing. :) I can state all the differences if you like? xD

I saw another stingray today. And some other cool jazz. Photos will be up in about a month. I'm staying in Thailand for nine days longer than expected.

2008-06-08 [Trist]: man that sucks. unless you like thailand. then i guess its ok. but i'm not a big fan of thai food and i get antsy when i stay in one place too long.

2008-06-08 [Ramirez]: Ooh, biatch wanted to stay. -snaps fingers all dramatically-

2008-06-08 [Trist]: oh, you did NOT go there!

2008-06-08 [Ramirez]: Oh I so did. =3

2008-06-08 [Avatar15]: I know the difference perfectly, theres no need.

2008-06-08 [Byne]: I love it here. Not a huge fan of the food that burns my lips and mouth, but the atmosphere here...The people I'm with.... And the conservation effort I'm helping.... :)

-Smacks Rami- Down boy! o:

And sorry Avatar. I'm kinda pissy at the moment. xD

2008-06-08 [Ramirez]: T.T

2008-06-09 [Byne]: -Cuddles.- I wish you were here with me?

2008-06-09 [Ramirez]: I wish I was too <3

2008-06-11 [Byne]: I'm just about finished my Rescue Diver certification...8D

No sharks yet. Some rays, but no sharks. ):

2008-07-21 [Byne]: Ah... Some good news? I've kinda been in contact with the director/creator/brainchild/star of Sharkwater. (: Rob Stewart. Wootness.

2008-07-22 [Tickle Me Emo]: Schweeeet! What did he have to say?

2008-07-22 [Byne]: He said thanks for our support and efforts to educate others on the crisis of sharks and other marine life. <3

2008-07-22 [Tickle Me Emo]: Cool, congrats! :D

2008-07-22 [Byne]: -Does a dance.-

2008-10-27 [Byne]: Just thought that I'd let people know this....

If you're familiar with the store Lush, they have a soap that benefits the sharks! If you buy their "Shark Fin Soap" which is also their's seaweed/seasalt soap, proceeds go towards the conservation of sharks...

OH! And a permanent research/patrolling station has been towed and secured off of the Darwin and Wolf Islands in teh Galapagos, in hopes of protecting the large shark species that are often poached there and to learn more about them.

2008-10-27 [Tickle Me Emo]: YAY, Lush!

2008-10-27 [Byne]: Just go into a store and ask them about it. One of the sales people should be able to give ya information. The soap smells really good, too!

2008-10-27 [Tickle Me Emo]: Mmm... I think they just put a Lush store in a shopping mall a bit of a drive from my home... but I always go shopping there on my birthday (because my birthday is right before Christmas... I love x-mas decorations!). I will defo check that out! :)

2008-10-28 [Byne]: We have them all over the place around here... Kinda... But they're a great store. x)

2010-01-12 [Byne]: If anyone is still watching this page, I thought it might be pertinent to say that I've met Boris Worm, one of the marine scientists they interviewed for the documentary "Sharkwater", and helped with research for "End of the Line," another documentary everyone should check out. I spent 45 minutes talking with him. Hopefully I'll be able to take his classes in third year!

2010-01-12 [Ramirez]: :3